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Chosen Relationships / Re: Trying to keep strong
« Last post by jwugg on Today at 01:11:39 PM »
It's a bumpy ride, but hold on tight, you're doing incredibly well. & we all want you to succeed. so ignore, ignore, ignore....

Put your metaphorical fingers in your ears & sing "la, la, la, I'm not listening".

It is a big game to him & he's used to mostly winning with you, so you're going to have to be really strong & brave. & keep remembering all the bad stuff he did & how you will fly without him.
  AFA your house (and SHEETS!) it is none of her business and she has no right to comment on it.  Why would she even care unless she is worried that word will get out that you have a certain color set of sheets?

To a non, this seems utterly ridiculous...the color of the sheets. Who cares? But to a PD...my NM would view this as an opportunity to exert control, to prove to herself that she wields power in someone's life. If she begins to feel as if her control over someone is slipping she will make a completely inappropriate demand of that person. If they comply she feels validated that she is still in control.

Although I am not a professional, my unesteemed opinion is this: Arianna's mother may have felt her control over her daughter was slipping when she realized her daughter did things that made her uncomfortable. She then may have chosen to pacify herself that she was indeed still the all-powerful mother (even though her daughter is an adult) by making an unreasonable demand and seeing if it is carried out.

In my experience this is a common PD behavior, especially Ns.
Chosen Relationships / Re: A No-Win Situation
« Last post by Rainstorm on Today at 01:05:16 PM »
I completely understand! Sometimes there has just been too much damage. I am going to try to stay married even after my kids leave home but it's going to be tough.
I read other's posts, the abuse is typically the same, I applaud their work at getting out-  but it is so hard for me to give myself credit to getting out,  Some of the stuff i read is so outrageous, obviously its not their fault, but its my story too. I still constantly ask myself if I did enough or was it really all my fault? But I respond to other people's posts that its not their fault, they did the right thing, so I need to accept that I did the right thing. Anybody catch my drift or feel the same way?

Yes, 100%.
Hi, to be clear my aunt is not a bully. She is an unknowing flying monkey for my PD mother. The apology I desire is more of an effort to get through through to her that she acting as a proxy to my NM is WRONG. People often think they are being "neutral" when in fact they are enabling the bully. They think it doesn't involve them but when they're asked to apologize they at least have to consider more their actions.

One thing the book Narcissistic Family says is ACONs have under-developed entitlement. Desiring an apology is completely OK. REQUESTING an apology or SEEKING an apology is also fair game. FORCING an apology is a bit different, but saying hey I can't continue this relationship the way it used to be because of these events that I haven't heard an  apology for, is simple straight-forward communication and self-care.

Also my aunt is seeing me through a distorted lens that she didn't see me through until a few years ago until my NM started this smear campaign about me. So it's not an impression of me that she formed on her own.
Separating & Divorcing / Re: I'm Officially an Idiot :)
« Last post by Long Time on Today at 12:59:17 PM »
IMO, you shouldn't have to give a ton of personal information to your convicted stbx husband, esp since the conviction was about dv, and controlling you.  It smacks strongly of stalking, and your attorney can word your response to say exactly that, and perhaps back opposing counsel down, if not your husband, with regard to where you spend all your nights when you aren;t with the kids, and anything else that's concerning. 

with regard to where you spend all your nights when you aren;t with the kids

Don't you wish you could just say, "it's none of your fu**ing business???"
Separating & Divorcing / Re: I'm Kind Of Scarred & REALLY Creeped Out
« Last post by Long Time on Today at 12:55:49 PM »
I agree with the other posters here.  It's about control, and when they sense that they are losing that, look out.

When I was still in the house with my ex, after I filed, waiting until the house sold, these are some of the things that happened.....

I NEVER would have thought mine would become physically violent, but he dumped liquid soap in the pot of coffee one morning.  (I was the coffee drinker in the house, and I KNOW that there was no way I would have left that much "soap residue" in the pot.)  And also, when I went to sip the coffee, I said "eww....what happened?"  And his reply?  "Yeah, I thought it tasted funny too, so I dumped mine out."  Now why on earth would he wait for me to taste mine without saying anything to me? 

Then a day later, he dumped alcohol in with a shower oil that I used daily after showering.  That was scary and really screwed up.  I was finished my shower, went to apply the oil, smelled the alcohol, started to shake because I felt I was being attacked.  I exited the bathroom to the stereo BLARING (it was 7 a.m.,) and once I entered the bedroom found that he cleared off the dresser except for a Maya Angelou quote left in the center.  I was totally freaked out.  Long story short, but I did go to the police, a car chase with him ensued, and he ended up coming to the police station claiming that I was following him all morning.  Officers said, "that's impossible, sir, she has been here with us."  Surreal.

I would never, in my wildest imagination, think that someone could act in that way.  He snapped that morning, and I think that even a person in their right mind, who is on the receiving end of the breakup, (which he was because I was the "initiator" of the divorce,) might be sad and despondent, but even with that, normal people don't act that way. 

I guess I am just sharing this with you to be cautious that you just never know with a PD, what they are thinking, and how "normal" their actions seem to them.  What you DO know about a PD is that they usually have a very difficult time dealing with stress or situations that are stressful.  Divorce is very stressful, so it is anyone's guess how a PD will react to that.

Involving the police was the one thing I was so afraid to do, and if it wasn't for my girlfriend (an Angel,) on the phone with me the  morning of the shower oil incident, repeating..."drive to the police...I'm here on the phone...I won't hang up until you are there..just keep driving...put the car in that direction..."  I would never have done that.  After that first time, though, it was so easy to call them the second time when I needed.  It also gave me written records, which proved to be invaluable later.

Stay on guard, stay strong, and DO NOT, I repeat DO NOT, hesitate to call the police in a moment if you feel the least bit afraid or threatened.  At best, they will tell him to leave the house for the night.

I am sorry to hijack a little...but I just wanted to use my experiences as a cautionary tale for you...
Separating & Divorcing / Re: I'm Officially an Idiot :)
« Last post by hhaw on Today at 12:52:57 PM »

I'm glad you're purging, and cleaning out... it is nice.  ::nodding::

About the personal information to your stbx in discovery......

no body answers EVERY single discovery question.  There are rote responses attorneys give, as cause, and if someone wants to push it, they have to ask the court to compel the answers.

IMO, you shouldn't have to give a ton of personal information to your convicted stbx husband, esp since the conviction was about dv, and controlling you.  It smacks strongly of stalking, and your attorney can word your response to say exactly that, and perhaps back opposing counsel down, if not your husband, with regard to where you spend all your nights when you aren;t with the kids, and anything else that's concerning. 

I've never seen anyone answer every discovery question, btw.  The Judge doesn' tget to see it..... discovery is used to suss out deposition questions, IME, which can be used in court. 

Also forgot to mention that IF she is unPD (borderline), they do generally require caretakers.  Perhaps your dad was her caretaker?  Try reading: Stop Care Taking the Borderline for insight.  It helped me tremendously and she could be grooming you and others to become her next caretaker.

As well, look at selective competencies.  Is she able to work and pay her bills but not clean her house (hoarding)?  Is she able to hide her dysfunction at work/church but not to close friends/family?  When an unPD loses a caretaker, things can go haywire.

And finally, perhaps she is grieving the loss of her husband and hasn't processed it.  Even if she isn't religious, maybe suggest to her a loss of a loved one support group?  They are free and it would perhaps help her.  For you, I would look at children of NA or AA meetings and/or NAMI.

Again, looking into her meds and overall physical health would be a priority.  It is difficult for anyone including a doctor to treat anyone if there true self isn't present but is high as a kite or low to the ground looking for the next high as a kite. 

Sorry you are going through this...hope some of these ideas help?

Chosen Relationships / Re: Trying to keep strong
« Last post by Empty Shell on Today at 12:47:27 PM »

You're doing great. Don't get sucked in the the toxic back and forth BS because if you do, you will be right back to square one.

So far, he's tried everything...

Innocuous questions or statements just to see if you will respond (he knows you are a kind person and ignoring even his innocent questions feels rude to you)

The plea of worry: just let me know you are ok? (maybe she'll believe I really am worried sick over here and answer)

Repetitive calls and texts: (if I keep pulling the slot machine lever, eventually she'll pay out and then I'm back in the game)

Nasty accusations: (hoping to trigger your anger into a response)

The birthday tickets: (something specific you two were going to do together, hoping to trigger your guilt)

Tearful, you have to keep telling yourself that even if you 'emotionally' have feelings invested and 'emotionally' have hope for a miracle that he will come to his senses and become a new man, you know LOGICALLY that the reality of that happening is pretty much zero.

If you know that in your gut and mind, then anything he says or does should be viewed as his Narc game to get what he selfishly needs and any contact with him will be devastating and toxic for you.

This statement is what concerns me:
"please stop contacting me if you can't give me what I want and deserve".

I worry that you are not ready to block him because a part of you is holding out hope for him to do or say something that suggests to you that he is ready to give you "what you want and deserve."

Your own statement to him tell HIM exactly what you need to hear. His pride has kept him from going that route yet.

But his other tactics haven't worked so at some point he'll probably use your own words against you and say what you are dying to hear. Words that give you hope. Words like he now suddenly realizes his faults and has 'changed' and will, in fact, "give you what you deserve."

I know you want and need to hear those words and even more, need him to do right by you for the mere justice of it all. Because you DO deserve it. But, honey, this man is not capable of it.

Needing anything from him and hoping for him to do something so you can feel better is dangerous and self-abusive. Because he is dangerous and abusive. Even though you are not talking to him, you are allowing him to talk to you, through email, text, voicemail. He is allowed to say anything he wants to you and keep himself alive in your mind, heart and life.

How can you move on with a constant barrage of contact from him? How can you focus on your own new life without him if he is right there whenever he chooses--making you feel hurt, sad, angry with his words. Still controlling you.

Maybe try to block him for a few days and see how you feel.

Please be careful and ready for his words of undying love and promises because he has seen the light or any other protestation that is exactly what you need to hear but dangerous for you to believe.
:yeahthat: :yeahthat: :yeahthat:

Sapphire speaks sooth!

Remember one more thing: Whenever he gets around to answering your question and telling you all of those things you need to hear that his words have no meaning. Words and promises mean nothing to him, they are just tools he uses to get what he wants. He's proven enough times with his actions that his words mean zero, no matter how much honey is dripping from them.

Don't make my mistake of thinking that somehow the pwPD has magically transformed and seen the light this time. It's not true. The monster is still the monster, it's only our own issues that makes us think a change may have occurred. There are only 2 possible outcomes with the monster: Either you will escape, or you will be consumed.

So sorry. Believe me, I know how it feels. The worst scars are the ones on the inside...

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