Dissociation and Feeling Things

[Hope66]

I am not sure if I'm writing in the right section, because the focus of this post is more about something I've noticed about myself, as a result of trying to focus on getting in tune with my 'felt senses' - as opposed to my usual tendency to dissociate.

It's made me realise that I typically don't 'feel' things the same as people around me seem to - and I'll give some examples of that:

I tend to have really hot baths, because I just don't 'feel' the temperature of the water, so tend to really have 'hot' water.  My partner has commented that he doesn't know how I can tolerate the hotness of the water, as he said it is really really hot!

If I go to see a doctor, or a dentist, and have to describe pain/discomfort, it is really hard for me to say 'how' I'm feeling - e.g. describing whether a cough is wet or dry - somehow I just 'don't seem to know' - it's not as if I can't 'feel' pain - but to know how my pain compares to someone elses - I just don't know.

I've noticed if I'm driving my car that any passengers who are with me, will end up moving the controls on the dashboard to regulate the temperature, and yet I am oblivious to what the temperature is like in the car.

I tend to go out with short sleeved clothes in supposedly cold weather - and I don't really feel the need to wrap up warm like other people seem to.

I just wondered if anyone else has experienced similar things, and whether it's due to a tendency to dissociate, or whether maybe it's something else???

Just wanted to ask for other people's thoughts/experiences.

Thanks,

Hope 

[AphoticAtramentous]

I can relate to this, Hope.
I tend to take really hot showers, and I've always struggled to describe my physical symptoms to people. It's like my senses are all fuzzy so I need the extreme side of things to actually feel some clarity.
Instead of short sleeved clothes in cold weather, I tend to wear long sleeved clothes in warm weather. Or jumpers and jackets on a warm sunny day and I feel just fine.
Not sure where it comes from. I think CPTSD affects the way we sense things in general, how we feel emotionally, how we feel physically. And I'm sure Dissocation would be a factor to blame for this as well in some way.

[Kat]

As I understand it, when we endured our trauma our minds cut off from our bodies.  Staying in the body was just too dangerous.  Instead, we tend to go into our heads.  I think maybe that's why you and Aphotic experience what you do. 

I read somewhere that victims of sexual abuse tend to have a lower tolerance for pain.  That didn't make sense to me.  I'd always felt like I had a much higher tolerance for pain than most.  When I read that CPTSD suffers tend to have a HIGHER tolerance for pain, it made much more sense.  (I couldn't explain the difference because it seemed that the victims of sexual abuse they were talking about were those exposed to it in childhood and on more than one occasion.)   

[Hope66]

Hi AphoticAtramentous,
Thank you so much for your reply - it is really helpful to hear your experiences and when you mentioned wearing long sleeves in warm weather and feeling fine, I related to that in that I tend to wrap myself up in really warm duvets at night, even in the middle of a hot summer, and I don't feel overly warm - I feel 'just right'.  I agree with you that C-PTSD seems to affect the senses significantly.

Hi Kat,
Thank you for your reply - and mentioning about how the mind cuts off from the body in C-PTSD and also your reading about the higher tolerance for pain in people who have C-PTSD - that's really interesting.

I wonder how many people end up going to see their doctor with concerns about their temperature regulation, when it might be due to symptoms related to trauma - must be a mind-field for doctors to work out how to treat people.

I'm really glad I posted about this, as receiving your replies has helped me - so thank you both.

Hope 

[woodsgnome]

I also tend to dress about the same--hot, cold, or moderate. When it comes to medical situations, I can be all over the map trying to describe adequately what I might be feeling, and definitely tend to ignore what many would regard as incredible pain.

Both emotional and physical feelings to me are more of a mystery than to lots of people, it seems. Asked about feelings, I have to sometimes stretch to come up with an honest assessment of what's real and what's not. The biggest feeling I seem to have with regard to people is straight out fear. If not outwardly, inwardly I can be a wreck and have no idea how to describe specific feelings. It's like I'm just too scared to even have them, as if they're not even allowed. At the very least, it's as if there's always this residue of fear controlling any feelings I might be having.

For years, I've walked with a limp; everyone recommended knee replacement. Did that; I'm Mstill about the same as to gait. My own theory is that psychologically, it's as if something is always pressing me down; I'm pretty sure the limp was almost like an embedded memory left over from being handled like a rag doll as an abused kid. But I can't fully explain that to people, either; and/or I get emotional trying to do so.

Not sure if any of that's wholly due to dissociation; there's probably avoidance and hyper-vigilance built in, but they all seem to work together. Regarding emotional indifference and/or the inability to describe feelings, maybe it's more a matter of 'ignorance is bliss' as a coping device; as in, I just don't want to know.

[Hope66]

Hi Woodsgnome,
Thanks for your reply, and it's really interesting to hear your experiences - especially about how your gait has remained the same despite medical intervention - your theory for your feelings sounds very reasonable to me, as I remember the information in 'The Body Keeps the Score' book by ?Van de Kolk, and he suggests the body remembers what happened - and communicates to us at different levels (at least that's how I interpreted what he said in his book).
I found your description of being handled like a rag doll as an abused kid to be really powerful - and I am so sorry that you've had that experience, and it made me feel 'speechless' - but I wanted to let you know that I can completely understand how difficult that would be to try to explain to others how you're feeling - and how emotional you would also feel - it must be incredibly hard to do. 

You've mentioned the addition of avoidance and hyper-vigilance, and yes, that makes a lot of sense to me, and I feel and do both of those things regularly as well.  They do all seem to 'work together' and I find it really helpful to consider the 'ignorance is bliss' coping device, because I feel sure that is also there. 

Thank you so much for your response.

Hope 

[Sceal]

Hi Hope,

I've only skimmed through the replies, so I'm not sure if this has been mentioned earlier.
I've had a viewpoint of myself for quite a while. That I'm split 3 ways. Body, Mind and Emotion, that they aren't connected or intergrated into each other. Which has led me to not take care of my physical symptoms until they are too hard to bear, or accept my emotions when they surface. Last winter I was in so much physical bain I was curled up on the floor for weeks. Painkillers didn't help, neither did heat therapy. It lessened it pain somewhat, but not enough. The physiotherapist that was at the hospital suggested I go see a psychosomatic-physiotherapist. And I've been going to one for the last few months. It's strange, it's challenging, it's uncomfortable. But I've noticed that I can start to feel my body, not just when it's in alot of pain.
Like if I pay attention I can now feel that I am actually sitting on a chair. I don't just know it, but I can feel it.

I don't know if you have the ability, but maybe you can look into it, and see if there is a psychosomatic physiotherapist near you?

[Kat]

I find it devastating, fascinating, and very clever how our bodies and minds respond to trauma.  I remember reading somewhere (I want to say it was in a Judith Herman book, but I'm probably wrong), that in babies who aren't held, the blood supply stays close to the core to keep the baby warm.  What ends up happening is you get an adult whose hands and feet seem much colder than those who experienced the warmth of a caretaker's embrace.

Sceal, what you wrote about the psychosomatic physiotherapy work you're doing reminded me of Jon Kabat-Zinn's Full Catastrophe Living: How to Cope with Stress, Pain and Illness.  It's a HUGE book, but very interesting and useful in that it's all about connecting back to your body.

I'm seeing a Somatic Experiencing therapist.  I mentioned that before I entered into therapy almost a decade ago, I was often embarrassed by how quickly I would get teary--even over the most ridiculous things.  I often tried to cover by pretending to choke and have to cough.  But, after a few years of therapy, I didn't experience this teary-ness anymore.  My SE therapist explained that a traumatized nervous system is always prepared for attack and terror.  She explained that at the time that I was experiencing this teary-ness, my window of tolerance for emotion was tiny, so the littlest thing would trigger a reaction.  As my nervous system repeatedly experienced going to some of those terrifying places without dying or bring destroyed, and experienced a safe relationship, it slowly learned to tolerate a bit more emotion.  Little by little that's what we're working on in the therapy I do with her. 

Sceal, I think your explanation of the three-way split is perfect.  I can feel that as true for myself as well.

[Sceal]

Kat I haven't heard of the people you mention or the books, but I'll try to remember to look them up. It sounds interessting.  What you also describe about the window of tolerance is something that I've had a lot of focus with in my own therapy for the last year. I feel I've learned alot by being taught about the window of tolerance, and how to very slowly and carefully trying to expand it. It's hard work, but I think maybe it's essential. A little like emotional-knowledge and emotional nurture from within yourself.

I am glad to meet someone who understands what I mean with the three-way split, it's been hard to get my psychologist and physioterapist to understand what I mean by it.

[Andyman73]

As I understand it, when we endured our trauma our minds cut off from our bodies.  Staying in the body was just too dangerous.  Instead, we tend to go into our heads.  I think maybe that's why you and Aphotic experience what you do. 

I read somewhere that victims of sexual abuse tend to have a lower tolerance for pain.  That didn't make sense to me.  I'd always felt like I had a much higher tolerance for pain than most.  When I read that CPTSD suffers tend to have a HIGHER tolerance for pain, it made much more sense.  (I couldn't explain the difference because it seemed that the victims of sexual abuse they were talking about were those exposed to it in childhood and on more than one occasion.)   

I wonder if they mean the survivors of SA/R who weren't hurt too badly during, have had their pain tolerance altered.  For me...I honestly don't know. First known SA/R, I wasn't 3 years old...and have been SA/R by over 2 dozen perps in my lifetime. CSA/R/CPA/adult SA, adult PA, and 20 years of DV. I know I sometimes don't outwardly register some forms of pain. But I suffered all my adult years with a painful bodymemory of penetration from those toddler R...that nearly floored me the pain was so intense.

[Hope66]

I hope to pop back over the weekend to read the replies here - I am pacing myself regarding processing things at the moment, and don't want to trigger myself.  But I'm really glad to see so many people discussing this topic - it's really good.

Hope 

[Andyman73]

Yes Hope, take your time and pace yourself. 🌷🌸🌺💐🌼🌻🌹

[Hope66]

Hi Andy,
Yes, I'm pacing myself, so much so that I've only just seen your reply here - and thank you for those colourful flowers - they are lovely!  You've made me smile - thank you.   
I still haven't re-read this thread yet - but I am hoping to do so soon - as I know there are things within it that I want to come back to.
Hope 

[BlancaLap]

It happened to me when I was a kid... and I think it is because of dissociation

[Andyman73]

Hi Andy,
Yes, I'm pacing myself, so much so that I've only just seen your reply here - and thank you for those colourful flowers - they are lovely!  You've made me smile - thank you.   
I still haven't re-read this thread yet - but I am hoping to do so soon - as I know there are things within it that I want to come back to.
Hope 

Hi Hope,
Glad you liked the flowers. Even more glad to have made you smile.    Will be patient, wait for you to come back. 
Andy