Sexual vs Emotional abuse symptoms *trigger warning*

[ElizabethGenevieve]

Moderators, if any of this is too graphic or inappropriate for readers please feel free to delete it immediately. I don't want to cause any trouble but I don't know where else to talk about this.

I come from a very emotionally/mentally abusive family, but I've also wondered if I was possibly sexually abused as a child. Since I don't have any clear memories of it, and since "false memories" are something I don't want to mess with, I know I can't be sure. But there are a few troubling symptoms I struggle with that seem more like what a sexual abuse victim experiences, not an emotional abuse victim. So I'm wondering if any of you have experience with this and/or if you think emotional abuse could cause it or if it sounds more like past sexual abuse might be something to look into. I'm very embarrassed to talk about any of these symptoms because I'm very ashamed of them and I don't want you all to think I'm a nut or pedophile or something. I just need to talk about it and find answers if I can. I hope I'm not alone.

There are 3 symptoms in particular that I'm wondering about:

* I began masturbating before I knew what sex was, and obsessed over drawing sexually explicit pictures/reading whatever sexual material I could find, again before I was told about sex (not sure exactly what age)

* My fantasies are all extremely violent, inappropriate, and abusive, and much to my extreme shame child sexual abuse stories turn me on

* I relate to stories of children who were molested. It feels like it's me they are talking about, or like I've experienced what they are describing. Rape and sexual abuse scenes are also extremely uncomfortable for me to watch in movies, but other types of violence are not anywhere near as disturbing.

Does anyone else here experience any of those symptoms? If so, is it because you were sexually abused or do you think emotional abuse could cause it or have I just gone off the deep end?

I promise I'm normally a very goody-two-shoes type person, which is why I hate myself so much for those symptoms. I feel so dirty and awful because those aren't my natural self, if that makes any sense at all.

[Three Roses]

I applaud you for your honesty. I relate to every single symptom you've mentioned except being stimulated by CSA. I think it's pretty common for people who've been molested to have that reaction - maybe it's true that all child abusers started out as the victim.

Keep in mind, having a stray thought pop into your head is much different than acting on it.

Recognition is the first step to healing, so good job you!

[ElizabethGenevieve]

Thank you so much for your support. Can I ask if you were sexually abused and if that's why you relate to most of what I said? And yes a stray thought is different than acting on it - I would NEVER dream of acting on it, so that is a comfort in a sense.

[Fightsong]

Hi E-G.   Just to say you aren't alone in anything that you feel. But you are clearly looking  for answers about why you feel these things. When I read your story i wondered - When you say no clear memories, what do you have memories of?  Was there any non-physical sexual dimension to your emotional abuse? Was anyone else in your FOO sexually abused do you know? I think there are many ways to violate a child's sexual boundaries and innocence.

[Blueberry]

Hi ElizabethG,
I can relate to some of this. I was sexually abused, physically, but not in a way that people automatically think of. It has been discounted by Ts in the past, and by myself of course too. For years I went up and down in my head about whether or not it should 'count'. So I agree with someonesomewhere that you should keep in mind that there are many ways to violate a child's sexual boundaries.

Another point: sometimes memories don't resurface until we're ready for them / have the inner strength to deal with them. Unfortunately for me, I never forgot most of the sexual abuse, but from what I've heard among other survivors that's unusual. I did have memories all through childhood / adolescence that disappeared when I was a young adult and then re-surfaced when I started intensive therapy. They were most definitely not 'false memories'.

A long time ago, one T pretty forcefully suggested that FOO might have done this or that to me (1 instance of physical abuse, 1 of emotional). This T really believed her own intuition here. There was zero resonance for me. No memories have ever come up of what she suggested. Also I have sometimes dreamt instances of physical abuse that never took place. I know this definitely because I would have died 10 times over. No way could you survive those injuries with no scars, the way I am. I think they were a graphic representation of the emotional abuse that FOO did to me. I'm describing all this for you to show you that there are tangible differences between my own real memories (even if tucked away for a while), my dreams/nightmares and ideas suggested to me. Though I do know of CSA survivors whose suppressed memories have resurfaced in dreams, so I'm not discounting it. Just saying, be aware of your own feelings, trust your own feelings.

And I agree with ThreeRoses that having these ideas in your head is much much different than acting on them. I used to feel really ashamed of these ideas too, so I can relate.

I sincerely doubt that you have gone off the deep end.
to you.

[ElizabethGenevieve]

Hi E-G.   Just to say you aren't alone in anything that you feel. But you are clearly looking  for answers about why you feel these things. When I read your story i wondered - When you say no clear memories, what do you have memories of?  Was there any non-physical sexual dimension to your emotional abuse? Was anyone else in your FOO sexually abused do you know? I think there are many ways to violate a child's sexual boundaries and innocence.

Thanks for taking the time to answer me, those are all great questions. When I say I have no clear memories it's because on several occasions things have happened that felt like they triggered a memory but my brain shut it down as fast as it came up. Also I've experienced what I suppose could be called body memories or emotional memories - just this strong gut feeling that something happened, triggered by very specific evens. But because I don't have a concrete visual memory, if you will, I'm not sure if anything happened or if I'm imagining it.

I don't know of anyone in my FOO who was sexually abused, but then we never openly talk about stuff like that so I might not be aware of it if it did. As far as whether there was a non-physical sexual aspect to the emotional abuse, I don't think there is/was. My dad was overly controlling and always saw me as "daddy's little girl" in kind of an obsessive way, but I don't think there was anything sexual about it. I'll keep that in mind though, I hadn't thought about there being other ways to violate a child.

[ElizabethGenevieve]

Hi ElizabethG,
I can relate to some of this. I was sexually abused, physically, but not in a way that people automatically think of. It has been discounted by Ts in the past, and by myself of course too. For years I went up and down in my head about whether or not it should 'count'. So I agree with someonesomewhere that you should keep in mind that there are many ways to violate a child's sexual boundaries.

Another point: sometimes memories don't resurface until we're ready for them / have the inner strength to deal with them. Unfortunately for me, I never forgot most of the sexual abuse, but from what I've heard among other survivors that's unusual. I did have memories all through childhood / adolescence that disappeared when I was a young adult and then re-surfaced when I started intensive therapy. They were most definitely not 'false memories'.

A long time ago, one T pretty forcefully suggested that FOO might have done this or that to me (1 instance of physical abuse, 1 of emotional). This T really believed her own intuition here. There was zero resonance for me. No memories have ever come up of what she suggested. Also I have sometimes dreamt instances of physical abuse that never took place. I know this definitely because I would have died 10 times over. No way could you survive those injuries with no scars, the way I am. I think they were a graphic representation of the emotional abuse that FOO did to me. I'm describing all this for you to show you that there are tangible differences between my own real memories (even if tucked away for a while), my dreams/nightmares and ideas suggested to me. Though I do know of CSA survivors whose suppressed memories have resurfaced in dreams, so I'm not discounting it. Just saying, be aware of your own feelings, trust your own feelings.

And I agree with ThreeRoses that having these ideas in your head is much much different than acting on them. I used to feel really ashamed of these ideas too, so I can relate.

I sincerely doubt that you have gone off the deep end.
to you.

Thanks so much for your support <3 And for sharing some of your experiences - you gave me a lot to think about. I've heard memories can resurface when you are "safe", and I'm afraid that's what will happen when I move out. But at the same time I kind of want that to happen just so I can be sure what I'm dealing with. I know people say you don't have to remember to deal with the symptoms, but I feel I do, at least to deal with some of the confusion.

Anyways, thanks again for sharing and reassuring me, it helps a lot. 

[ElizabethGenevieve]

Hi E-G.   Just to say you aren't alone in anything that you feel. But you are clearly looking  for answers about why you feel these things. When I read your story i wondered - When you say no clear memories, what do you have memories of?  Was there any non-physical sexual dimension to your emotional abuse? Was anyone else in your FOO sexually abused do you know? I think there are many ways to violate a child's sexual boundaries and innocence.

All of that sounds just like what I'm dealing with, except there isn't any family story of sexual abuse. I don't have a therapist, I've heard it takes a lot of work to find a good one, plus I'm not sure what my family/friends would think of that. I know I could keep it a secret but I hate keeping secrets. I'll consider it after I move out.

[Blueberry]

When I say I have no clear memories it's because on several occasions things have happened that felt like they triggered a memory but my brain shut it down as fast as it came up. Also I've experienced what I suppose could be called body memories or emotional memories - just this strong gut feeling that something happened, triggered by very specific evens. But because I don't have a concrete visual memory, if you will, I'm not sure if anything happened or if I'm imagining it.

'Brain shutting a memory down as fast as it came up': I'm getting that all the time at the moment. It's more on emotional/verbal abuse, and also realising connections between said abuse and current problems I have functioning in daily life. For me, it's a definite sign that there's more than enough going on in healing and in remembering and in realising and this is therefore a protective measure. It could be this in your case too.

From what I've learnt in psycho-education, our bodies do have memories, it's not just our heads that do, so "body memories or emotional memories - just this strong gut feeling that something happened, triggered by very specific events" makes a lot of sense to me. Especially since very specific events trigger this gut feeling. I used to get a lot of body memories in the form of pain - all over the place: shoulders, arms, hands, feet (some because of general emotional abuse / dysfunctional family stuff, not just sexual abuse). There has never come a point where I've had to say to myself 'oops, that pain was for nothing. Obviously I imagined something there...' And I've been on this healing journey for a good number of years now. So I mean there's been plenty of time for these  internal 'oops' comments to come. I also have a very active Inner Critic who has been getting quieter in this field over the years rather than louder.

Feeling "safe" enough to remember might not occur just because you move out. This feeling of "safe" isn't just a physical feeling. It could take longer. I'm telling you this because you mention being afraid that remembering is precisely what will happen when you move out.

I'm a bit stuck in a different area of my healing at the moment. Thinking the above through and writing it for you has helped me in this other area, so thank you for giving me this opportunity.
Just to reassure again, you're definitely not going crazy. No way.

[ElizabethGenevieve]

When I say I have no clear memories it's because on several occasions things have happened that felt like they triggered a memory but my brain shut it down as fast as it came up. Also I've experienced what I suppose could be called body memories or emotional memories - just this strong gut feeling that something happened, triggered by very specific evens. But because I don't have a concrete visual memory, if you will, I'm not sure if anything happened or if I'm imagining it.

'Brain shutting a memory down as fast as it came up': I'm getting that all the time at the moment. It's more on emotional/verbal abuse, and also realising connections between said abuse and current problems I have functioning in daily life. For me, it's a definite sign that there's more than enough going on in healing and in remembering and in realising and this is therefore a protective measure. It could be this in your case too.

From what I've learnt in therapy - actual psycho-theory - our bodies do have memories, it's not just our heads that do, so "body memories or emotional memories - just this strong gut feeling that something happened, triggered by very specific events" makes a lot of sense to me. Especially since very specific events trigger this gut feeling. I used to get a lot of body memories in the form of pain - all over the place: shoulders, arms, hands, feet (some because of general emotional abuse / dysfunctional family stuff, not just sexual abuse). There has never come a point where I've had to say to myself 'oops, that pain was for nothing. Obviously I imagined something there...' And I've been on this healing journey for a good number of years now. So I mean there's been plenty of time for these  internal 'oops' comments to come. I also have a very active Inner Critic who has been getting quieter in this field over the years rather than louder.

Feeling "safe" enough to remember might not occur just because you move out. This feeling of "safe" isn't just a physical feeling. It could take longer. I'm telling you this because you mention being afraid that remembering is precisely what will happen when you move out.

I'm a bit stuck in a different area of my healing at the moment. Thinking the above through and writing it for you has helped me in this other area, so thank you for giving me this opportunity.
Just to reassure again, you're definitely not going crazy. No way.

Very interesting, that does sound like what I'm dealing with. And yeah, at the moment I can't even imagine feeling safe, even when I'm on my own because to an extent I'm terrified of being alone with my mind, even though being home with my FOO isn't helpful either. So I guess I'll just have to wait and see if memories resurface someday or not. I wish I could know for sure. Thanks so much for reassuring me that I'm not going crazy - it sure feels like it sometimes.

And I'm so glad it helped you some to talk things out with me, I hope you continue to heal and make progress and all that good stuff

[lisbeth]

I completely relate, except for violent fantasies.  I find myself aroused by the idea of CSA, like on Law and Order SVU. I imagine that I'm the child.  And have had fantasies of being forced as an adult.  My guess is it's a way of taking back control of something I had no control over, my abuse started early (earliest memories from when I was 3 or 4.  These are definite symptoms that I had before I started to have memory breakthroughs.  Get a therapist who can work through these issues with you safely.

[ElizabethGenevieve]

lisbeth: sorry you relate but thanks for the support. Honestly I'm too scared to get a therapist - I'm pretty sure most of the people in my life would discourage that idea, and I don't think I could stomach doing it secretly. I hate doing things the few people I actually trust don't know about, especially a very good friend of mine. Was it therapy that gave you memory breakthroughs?